1. I thought my proposal was pretty clear. It was in the linked post that you obviously did not read and it basically has to do with play-offs. It would, in my opinion, make more sense to let fewer teams into the Olympics and World Championships (say 8?) and have play-offs among them.
2. Regarding the Spanish and what they proved, I guess if you don't see a problem with the "world champions" losing by 37 with the difference between the two teams being as big as that of boys and men then we don't have much to talk about.
3. Regarding the American loses, they were simply part of the Americans waking up to the truth that the rest of the world now has teams that can actually beat them if they don't pay due attention and they don't come with carefully selected top-breed NBA teams.
4. Regarding doping control and the Americans I have two things to say
   • Give us a reference about NBAers *not* undergoing doping control in the Olympics.
   • How is life for the Greek Olympic athletes without steroids? Number of medals this year? I know Greece got the gold in doping with 15 of its athletes having been caught full of steroids and shit.

Dear Fotios,
For some reason you are frustrated and maybe unhappy with your origins. Am I right? You find all greek things bad and worse than the respective americans. That's ok, it is your opinion. But you should at least try to be objective. In the last months, you criticises Greek national team in football, in basketball, the greek athletes and the greek TV. Absolutely acceptable. But, thing before writing about the golden medals in doping, who is the person who died at the age of 39 after having 2-3 earlier heart attacks and was never caught for doping. You should remember where all these things started.
Concerning the Greek TV, I guess you do not know that much because you live abroad since many years. Let me just remind you that the Greek TV is the unique in EU that leave films and series in their original form (without duplicating the voices), there are many documentaries, like Exantas for example, that are awarded many times in international contests and at the end of the day, nobody ever claimed that it is the best. Neither the football team, nor the athletics team. But taking into consideration the size of the country we are more than good and the fact that your favorites americans that need play offs to be sure that they won't lose, were so anxious to win Greece, demonstrates how good we are in basketball. That's all and I have nothing else to say, because you are not objective in my opinion on this issue.
ANy comment about Phelp's 7th medal? Or about the story with Jackie Joyner-Kersee and Xanthou? Nothing at all?

Dear Athanasie,

my feelings, your feelings and in general the feelings of anyone who chooses to post on this site are to be kept private and not discussed unless he/she chooses to do so.

I post and criticise Greece and the Greeks not because it is the only place where there are things that are wrong but because it is a place where the number of things that are wrong is unacceptably high. I suppose there are many other countries in the world where this is true (see for example Italy which I also criticise) but obviously I can only write about what I know and have experienced. Americans have their issues but they are relatively few in my opinion.

You talk about doped American athletes. Here is an exercise for you: Take the number of successful American athletes and divide it by the the number of those Athletes that have been found doped. Then do the same for the Greeks. Then compare the numbers. See what I mean?

Phelp's medal was decided on photo-finish. The experts were there, both sides were there, third parties were there, the technological means were there. What more can I or you say?

Regarding basketball, you take a single win (xekolothikan) and you make it sound like it somehow has defined the status quo. Leave the Americans alone mate and see if you can beat teams like Lithuania, Russia, Argentina, Spain and even China. The NBAers are a class above the rest. You have to be blind not to see that.

Fotie,
I see that they are not just one class above the rest, but many more, but you have to accept that they have not won anything the last 8 years. When they will win (most likely in a 5-6 days) you can start saying that they have the best team. Greece has repeatedly won all the afore-mentioned teams (and lost ofcourse) and has managed to be classified among the BEST. In my opinion, that is something that you fail to accept. It is important to stay in the top, angd Greece has managed to do so. You should not always be the first, but being always among the first proves that you are good. I would accept about "xekoloma" if you were referring to football. There, we are not among the best. We have to try hard to stay at the top.

Concerning your exercise, i am not going to do it. I do not accept to add Griffith Joyner (remember her? woman, like a man, world record in 100 m, still exist, died at the age of 39, after her 34th (i think) she had 2-3 heart attacks) in the non-dopped athletes. By the way, NOT EVEN ONE Greek athlete was caught to be dopped when he won. Sampanis and Chalkia were caught 4 years after their medals, and all the rest were not medalists.
And in any case, I AM NOT ACCEPTING what they tell me... I am trying to filter it. I am not accepting that Xanthou has no medal in the olympic game sof Atlanta and instead Kersee has it. The so huge americans, apart from being good, sometimes they need to be helped by the judges etc etc (as greeks were helped at the athens games for obvious reasons) and that changes the results and as a consequence your exercise has no practical importance for me.

The way you present this is a bit misleading. They have not won anything in 8 years needs to be qualified with how many games they lost in these years, how many games they played and maybe most importantly in how many international tournaments they took part. Care to enlighten us? You will see that these guys only take part in World competitions right? So, by the same token, the Greek team has *never* won anything (?!) simply because it never won Olympic gold or the World championship. How fair is that statement?

Beyond that I will accept that they had a bad streak which is why this team is called "redeem team".

No comment to the rest of the stuff that you mention.

I am wondering why you are not commenting the rest of comment!

USA has lost a lot, and in one recent competition they lost by Serbia, Spain and Argentina. Maybe it was in USA

http://www.fiba.com/pages/en/events/competition/p/competitioncode/WMM/fisc/false/lang/EN/roundid/3453/season/2002/stattype/select_round.html

I repeat that I do not say that the Americans are not the best. All I am saying is that when it comes to the world cup or OLympic finals, you have to prove it. Every single time.

Hopefully, Greece will face (if we win against Argentina) the team USA in the semifinals. Like two years ago.

and especially the stuff in the end: So, who's the champ?

The link you gave us is from the 2002 FIBA world cup which I mention also there and comment on it. Look at the overall stats. The US NBA based teams have lost a few games going to toutnaments unprepared with incomplete and substandard NBA teams and people who are jealous of them simply choose to concentrate on these losses ignoring the overwhelming statistics but more than anything else the truth that anyone who knows the game is pretty clear about: there is no comparison to be made between a real dream team and Greece, Spain, or whatever. Sorry mate! Too weak, too slow, too little. It's like Jutta and me having a one-on-one. Maybe she can beat me if I am skunk drunk. What, you don't know who Jutta is? See here.

Fotios is right, there is a reason they are called the Redeem Team. Lets go for facts first. Yes, USA basketball had seen its better days before Athens and that bronze medal never seemed right, especially after incredible wins in prior years with the likes of Jordan, Pippen, Miller and some other very notable players. Since then (2004) they have gone an amazing 21-1 and have shown the world once again how dominant American basketball is. The point that I feel Fotios was trying to make was that Spain's boasting of "world champion" is unfounded due to the fact that they didnt play the United States.

Now allow me expand on this... When you have such a dominant team, like the USA, who had been a gold medal winners for years and a team like Spain who has consistent silvers, Spain cannot rightly claim such a great status in a game they only won once. Use your futbol explanation and lets say the USA suddenly wins the World Cup... No one, not even the USA would say that they are the dominant futbol league in world. And by Fotios' rational the USA would have to defeat the likes of Brazil to be really considered a dominant world power in futbol. I think this is a completely fair assessment.

Another thing to understand is the prior, losing, dream team couldnt work together, and had some big heads that couldnt quite get the job done. In this case, the Redeem Team, has been working together for the team and has (obviously) shown the power they possess on the world stage once again. It's nothing new in the Olympics. There is always (or has always seemed to be) a dominant performer in some part of the Olympics. Whether it be gymnastics, swimming, or running... there is always the "Team To Beat". The USA just happens to be "The Team To Beat" when it comes to basketball. Spain never really had a claim to it.

Argentina just beat Greece by 2 points. It was close but Argentina were better although just slightly. Like I was saying before, Greeks were a bit out of touch with reality after that unexpected and let's face it, lucky, win against the Americans. Greece should focus on getting a bit of power under the basket as they lack a decent powerful center and Big Sofo (aka Baby Shaq), who can become a really strong 4, is still pretty weak. Then maybe they can start beating teams like Argentina and even Spain, consistently. The US will still remain out of reach of course. I was wrong to say that Greece is one of the best 4 teams. They have consistently failed to prove that in this Olympiad. They are probably 5th or 6th in the world in overall value.

Fotie,
another interesting expression of your ideas about everything "non-american".

When the US team lost from Greece you did not say that the US is just not within the 2 best teams in the world, but rather you suggested that FIBA should change the way the game is played (with Play-offs etc etc).
Now that Greece lost and did not enter semifinals (just by 2 points, therefore any other result could have come) you accept the way the competition is, and you conlcude that Greece is not among the 4 best teams, because Greece did not enter the semifinals.
This might be true, but I DO NOT THINK THAT YOUR WAY OF THINKING AND DRAWING CONCLUSIONS IS OBJECTIVE AND CONSISTENT.

Ofcourse you are free to say whatever you want, just try to be objective so that people pay attention to what you say and they do not discard your thoughts directly.

if you were a bit more attentive you would have noticed that you are trying to compare the following two things:

• the US team in 2006 that lost only once by 6 points - to a team that shot 63% (35-of-56) from the field and made 31 of 44 shots over the final three periods - while beating everybody else with crazy scores.
• the Greek team in 2008 that lost 3 times, was overwhelmed by Spain and completely crushed by team USA. A Greek team that, might I add, does not even have reebound this year (Big Sofo being the corpse that he is currently).

once again, good work!

Someone who loses from the first three does not go directly to the 5th or 6th position...
good work to you fotios. And by the way, I am not here to say who is the best, the 4th or the 5th. I am just saying that even when you lose (as you I mean US), accept it, and remember your saying that "The first is first, and the second is nothing" or "The winner takes it all" etc etc. And in 2006 it was Spain.

If you don't accept it, then you have a problem in accepting the rules, and this is baddddddddddddddd

rules change all the time mate - even constitutions get amended. Regarding the actual position of team Greece in the world of basketball I was also thinking that they are in the top 4 (4th actually) and I even wrote it here, but after seeing how weak they are under the basket this year I changed my mind. Besides, it is probably one of these two positions (5th or 6th) that they will actually get in this Olympiad.

The thing is that the 4th or the 6th team in a tournament might not have dramatic differences. But the first is always the first and means that he won more than anybody else, especially in the critical games.

By the way, and to make things clear. I like the way the US team plays. I admire the talent and the skills of the players, but I hate the fact that they (used to) play as kids in a funfair. Everybody for himself. For his own stats and if the win comes, cool, if not, patience. I have the same feeling also for the Brasilian team in soccer (in my blog would be football:-), but ofcourse, there the difference is not so big between Brasil and other traditional football powers, like argentina, Germany, Italy etc.

I have asked you to find American magazines and newspapers of the day before the 2006 game of greece against USA (just to check what americans were saying). You have not done it till now.

I found the ESPN post-game report by Sheridan:

"Dwight Howard dunked emphatically. Dwyane Wade bounced the ball off the backboard, caught it and stuffed. Elton Brand jammed an alley-oop pass. Finally, LeBron James flew down the lane for a tomahawk.

As the crowd roared, the Greeks lined up at the other end and shot free throws. The moment foretold Greece's 101-95 victory in the semifinals of the world championships"

http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/wbc2006/news/story?id=2568543

yeah, I like this article. In fact I think I have read it before.